Cashman talking extension with wrong Yankee

It’s been written recently that Brian Cashman has been attempting to get Russell Martin signed to a 2-year extension on top of the $7.5M owed him this year.  The total deal would run though the 2014 season and was said to be for 3 years and $20 Million.  That contract looks very reasonable after seeing the monster 5 yr – $70-75M deal Yadier Molina is looking at.

However, with Francisco Cervelli & Austin Romine on the team, I think the Yanks can afford to “wait and see” how Martin produces this year and worse case scenario offer him the roughly$12.5M arbitration offer required for 1st round compensation under the new CBA.

The guy they need to be talking extension with NOW is Robinson Cano.  Cano is without a doubt the team’s best player.   In this period of decreasing offense around MLB, he is a valuable commodity – a perennial .300+ hitter with 25+ HR & 40+ Doubles power who plays Gold Glove caliber defense at a premium up-the-middle position. He’ll finally assume the #3-spot in the lineup he should have been at 2 years ago and I expect his production will only increase hitting 3rd all yr between Granderson & ARod. 

Cano is 29 years old and due to some foresight by Cashman is still signed for this yr and next under the extension he signed in February 2008.  Without that extension Cano would have been a Free Agent after 2011 but is instead locked up under team options at the affordable prices of $14M this yr and $15M next. 

You may be saying, why look to extend Cano now when he has 2 affordable yrs left?  The answer is length of contract.  With 2 more years of premium production, Robinson will be entering Free Agency in 2014 heading into his 31-yr old season.  Based on similar deals given out in recent years, a hitter like Cano who has the advantage of being extremely durable and playing 2B will be looking at a minimum of $20M per year over 7-8 years.

As indispensable as Cano is, do the Yanks really want to lock up another player to a huge contract into his late 30’s?   The way team’s are spending money these days, and with Boras as his agent, the Yanks won’t be getting any hometown discounts so we’ll be looking at paying another player $20m+ when he’s 37 & 38 yrs old.  As we have seen with Giambi & Posada and now with Jeter & ARod, these albatross contracts can be very inhibiting.   So to avoid paying Cano $20M+ til he’s 38, Cashman should strike now.  Rip up his remaining deal and offer the same 7-8 year deal now for around $20M and you essentially shave the last 2 years off the deal and have Cano only up to his 35 or 36-yr old season. 

With Cano’s durability (5 straight years of 159+ games) and consistency, the risk of signing him now as opposed to 2 yrs from now is small.  The only added cost would be paying him $20M this yr and next, so a net cost of $11M more.  That is a small price to pay to lock Cano up now through his age 35 season and not have to pay him to 37 or 38.   By waiting til 2014, they would also risk having to pay him much more than $20M per season if he raises his production the next 2 year like I think he will hitting in the 3-hole for the first time.

Cano is clearly the class of the Yankees now and with Montero being traded, he is the team’s only pure hitter in his prime capable of hitting .300 with power over the next few years.  Cashman made a great move in 2008 by signing Cano to an extension that has saved the team millions.  He needs to do the same now or risk being held hostage by Boras in 2014 and repeating the cycle of paying $20M+ to players into their late 30s.  What does everyone think?

About fishjam25

Was a 4-yr Pitcher and Communications Major at Seton Hall University in the 90s. His knowledge & opinion of the game comes from his background as a player and ardent lifetime Yankee fan. However, Fishjam also incorporates sabermetrics and statistical support to form a well-rounded view of the game.

Posted on February 29, 2012, in Hot Stove, Personal Opinion, Player Analysis, Signing & Trade Speculation and tagged , , . Bookmark the permalink. 47 Comments.

  1. fishjam, it probably won’t come as any surprise to you but I happen to disagree with the theory of extending Cano now with 2 years remaining on his contract. At the end of this coming season I may chance my mind about an extension but that remains to be seen.

    But with 2 years remaining on a players contract in my opinion it’s foolish to extend him especially at approximately $20MM for an addition 5 years or so. An awful lot can happen in a players career over 2 years that can make a team regret spending $100 to $140MMM plus before they had to.

    First off at the end of the 2013 season when Cano’s team option expires as you mentioned he will be 31 years old. Why do you assume the Yankees will be forced to offer him a 7 or 8 year deal at that time? Kemp who recently signed an 8 year deal was 27 at the time he signed the extension. Fielder who just signed with the Tigers a 9 year deal will only be 28 this year. I’m not sure Cano at the age of 31 to start the 2014 season would command an 8 year deal, 7 possibly but even that depends how he performs the next 2 years, in my opinion. But 8 who knows.

    The other question that I would pose. Is let’s assume the Yankees took your suggestion and tore up Cano’s current contract and re-signed him for 7 or 8 years now at $20MM per (a $140 or $160MM total depending on the years). Haven’t the Yankees towards the end of that contract put themselves in exactly the same nightmarish position they were recently in with Jeter’s new contract at the age of 37. A PR nightmare. Cano by his 36 or 37th birthday will have been the face/captain of the Yankees and with them for about 16 years by then.

    In my opinion there are a lot more moving parts to extending Cano early then just the pieces you mention.

    Besides and this is just my opinion I do NOT see this new ownership of the Yankees offering more then 6 year guaranteed deals to any player going forward. Evidenced by the Yankees this past winter seemingly only willing to go 5 years with a 6th year vesting option for Sabathia just before he could have opted out at the age of 30 (he’ll be 31 in July). I just don’t see them being forced to either now or in 2 years to give Cano a 7 or 8 year guaranteed deal.

    • UYF & Kenny – My 2 senior citizen amigos, I’ll break it down for you and address you both individually.

      First UYF, I’ll summaize your points:
      1) Extension not worth risk with 2 yrs remaining

      Cano is arguably the most durable player in baseball today leading all AL players in games played over the last 5 years and is an automatic .300+, 25+ HRS. Where is the risk? Extensions are given to avoid paying millions more in Free Agency. in this case an extra 5 years now at $100M would be much cheaper than dealing with Boras in Free Agency, especially if Cano plays even better like I think he will hitting 3rd.

      2) Why do I assume the yanks will have to go 7 or 8 yrs to sign him in FA after 2013?

      Someone will offer 7 yrs – bank on it! Jayson Werth got 7 yrs at the age of 32! Pujols just got 10 yrs at 32, ARod got 10 yrs at 33. The list of players getting 7 or 8 yrs just 1 or 2 yrs younger than Cano is long. teams around MLB are flush with cash and if Cano keeps playing like he does soeone will give him 7 yrs.

      3) At end of Cano’s contract, they will have a Jeter situation

      You are arguing in my favor here. I advocate a 7yr deal now which will make him 35 at the end of the deal. if you wait til 2014 and give him 7 or even just 6 yrs he’ll be 36 or 37. I don’t understand how my way isn’t better? Any way, Jeter’s situation is totally unique – he’s an icon with huge off the field value. He puts people in the seats and has cross-over appeal. Your basic 40-yr old housewife knows who Derek Jeter is but has never heard of Robinson Cano.

      4) New ownership won’t go beyond 6 yrs

      Says who? Tex got 8 yrs, CC got 7 yrs, then 3 yrs later got a 6 yr extension and he’s a 320 pound pitcher. Yes, I know the last yr is an option but unless he has a left shoulder injury its guaranteed. They were willing to go 6 or 7 yrs (depending who you beleive) on 32 yr old pitcher Cliff Lee. Again,.

      I’m only advocating a 5 or 6 yr deal for Cano on top of the 2 yrs he already has coming to him – the difference is I’m giving it to him now rather than have to possibly give him 7 or 8 yrs at even more money when every other club in the league can bid on him after 2013.

      • Fishjam, class is in session!!!!!UFY, Your a real smart guy haven’t you learned by now argueing with the Fish is a mistake.The man knows this game.
        Cano is a no brainer to lock up long term,till 35-36.He is the best all around player in the AL right now.Look at his last 3 years nobody is better and he ‘s playing a premium position.
        UFY its ok to have different opinions ,and that’s what makes blogging fun,but the facts are not opinion and argueing with someone who knows the game better than one self is foolish.

        • Ballpark. That’s why blogging is fun so others can voice concerns and opinions. Gloating someone is better is foolish. Even though Fish writes for the blog. I take what everyone says on the blog with the same weight being writer or just a commenter of the site.

          All opinions are good one when talking Yankee baseball. It’s different ideas and thoughts that make this blog fun.

          • True Matt that was my opinion.Wasn’t it?

            • Whts up BP?
              Haven’t chatted in a while. What are your thoughts on the team?

              I’ve come around a little on the Ibanez signing but I still contend they should have sought a trade for a better hitter. Ibanez was better than the other FAs available I supposse.

              I’m still a bit nervous about the Pineda trade as well. But it will take years to see how that trade pans out and I really like the Campos kid.

              Anxious to see if Tex can get back to hitting .290-.300 or if the talk about using the whole field will disappear after a few weeks.

              • fishjam, don’t worry about Pineda. This was the Yanks chance to get a front line pitcher who is under control. This was a steal for the Yanks, nobody is giving up this kind of pitcher. I don’t rate trades or free agents or trades on how they turn out. That is beyond anyones control. This was the best move at this time.

                • You’re probably right Doug. All the so-called experts loved the deal. Myself, I’m a little apprehensive that Pineda reaches his potential as a #1 or #2 starter. But I’ll reserve my judgement til I see Pineda pitch during the season.

                  I’m a little concerned about his velocity dropping and his lack of a 3rd pitch. I loved Montero’s bat but his lack of a true position made it OK to deal him for a PROVEN #1/#2 pitcher. I’m just not totally sold on Pineda being that #2 yet. I hope he is.

            • True it was. Just saying opinions cans never be wrong only straights facts can. Good to see you stopping by Bpark.

              What do you think of the Aardsma signing?

  2. Fishjam…
    Sorry big guy but, I agree with uyf1950 on a few things, which I will endeavor to enumerate.
    1–Yankees have stated time and again they do not extend contracts while the player is still under contract!
    2–2nd basemen have a habit of breaking down in their 32-34 years, sometimes sooner.
    3–At 31, a 5 year contract is too long.
    4–2014 He will be 31 years old and A-Rod will be 39. Maybe A-Rod will still be productive and maybe not. If he slows down in 2013 they should move Cano to 3rd for 2014 with a 3-4 year contract. If he will not move…let him walk!
    5–If Cano wants a longer contract then 4-5 years, Let him walk!
    6–We have good 2nd and 3rd basemen coming up around 2014!
    Well, what say you guys? I am to hard on Cano? I don’t think so, offer arbitration, and pick-up a high draft pick for him. This is the new Yankees, fans and the only way they have of getting any high picks.
    I know, I am the vice principle that was the mean guy in school but, did you ever notice when the vice moved into the principle seat…he was a nice guy? The job dictates how one is perceived, if (when) Cashman starts being the vice principle (as he was with Jeter) fans are not going to understand him at all.
    As uyf said, The days of the long contracts are over with. 🙂

    • Well at least I know 1 person agrees with me.

    • Your turn Ken 🙂

      Addressing your points…..

      1) Yanks don’t do extensions.
      This is a myth that Cashman uses when he doesn’t WANT to extend people. He just tried to extend Russell Martin! And they gave Cano an extension in 2008 buying out his arbitration yrs and his first 2 Free Agent years, the contract he is still under.

      2) 2B tend to break down by 32-34.
      Cano is not like normal 2B. Traditional 2B are players built on speed, defense, light hitting and take a beating turning double plays. Cano is a hitting force who is as smooth as silk in the field. he never gets taken out at 2nd base because he steps to the SS-side of the bag when turning 2. He can do this because he has a rocket arm. He is as durable as any player in MLB and even if he couldn’t play 2B, his bat would play at any position on the diamond.

      3) At 31, 5 yrs is too long
      Then kiss him goodbye because if you let him get to FA, he’ll def get 6 and I think he’ll get 7, maybe 8 years

      4) Move Cano to 3B in 2014
      Why? He’s the best 2B in baseball. Why mess with a good thing? He skills won’t deteroriate by 2014 at age 31-32.

      5)If can wants more than 4-5 yrs, let him walk
      That’s your opinion but he’s your best player and only natural hitter. ARod will be 39 and Tex 35. Where’s the offense come from in 2014 when Granderson will also be a FA?

      6) We’ll have guys ready to play 2B & 3B in 2014
      Maybe, but can any of them hit .300+, 25+ and play GG defense? Play hardball with everyone else but Cano needs to be locked up. Offering a 5 year extension now prevents the ugliness after 2013 and only locks him up til his 35 yr old season. Then you can let him walk and play the kids.

      • Fishjam…
        You done done it again! 🙂
        I will try to clarify my Opinions———-
        1–The extensions all were done before the start of the season and when there were advantages for the team, that’s what he gets paid for.
        2–We know Canos hitting will stand up, his durability is unquestionable, that is why I said he would end-up at 3rd base, if they extend for 2013 to 2018.
        4–Because, with his bat and arm etc. he is a better power hitter in a hitters spot. WE can use a lighter bat at 2nd but, not at 3rd.
        5–If they extend him for 5-6 years he will be 35-36 for a 3rd baseman that isn’t old. For a 2nd baseman…!
        6–I ment to say 2nd, SS and 3rd base! SS and 2nd can get away with a light bat until they improve to around .285-.295 and maybe 10-15 HRs. And which one of us says they can’t carry their own water?
        That is why I said 5-6 years for Cano from 2013 to 2018+/- at 3rd base (maybe start him when a 2nd baseman comes up)…

        I hope this is understandable, just my opinion. You have been there, you know one always tries for perfection, if one falls short a bit…one still wins. If one tries for good enough or ok and are a bit short…they loose…not my cup of tea!

        Of course one thing good came of this, Ballpark showed up…he just couldn’t take it with my dumb reply…dat tare is funny , Yup, show nuf is! 🙂

    • Ken my old buddy,Fish has schooled you and ufy,Ken that is the worst post Ihave ever seen you write.You are paying too much attention to

      • Ballpark, I’m sorry that you find my opinions somehow less worthy of sharing then those expressed by others. I have nothing but the utmost respect for fishjam and his knowledge of the Yankees. And I enjoy reading his comments and opinions, but that’s all they are, his opinions.

        The world and this blog would be very, very boring if everyone saw everything exactly the same way. Matt eluded somewhat to that in a previous comment to you. Obviously you and fishjam go back a ways so I won’t bother to defend my earlier comments/opinions to you.

        Perhaps the next time you can share your opinions on the Yankees instead of taking others to task and ridiculing them for their opinions. I hope you get a chance to read this before it disappears. Have a good day.

        • No need to apologise,I think opinion and presentation of the facts need to be seperated.On your opinions ,I may differ but you are entitled to them.On facts and theory I can dissagree.
          Fishjam presents the facts clearly and his are correct.Not opinion.
          UFY i would like to debate more with you but unfortunetly My time is limited.
          Trust me on one thing,I know baseball.

      • Ballpark…
        Is this the only way to get you to show up around here? If so I’ll make like a fool more often.
        By the way, just between you and I…don’t tell anyone…Fishjam and you always do that to me.
        I try but, what I want to write and how it reads are two different things. I haven’t read anything on this posting yet but, I know he is against letting Cano walk.
        Nice to read your stuff again stick around for the summer. 🙂

  3. fishjam – I have a very simple question for you.

    If as you say someone will offer Cano 7 or even 8 years you believe if he hits FA after the the 2013 season at the age of 31 that would take him through the age of 37 or 38. Why in the world would Boras allow Cano to basically only sign a 5 or 6 year extension now with the Yankees that would take him through the age of 35 or 36?

    Why wouldn’t Boras/Cano hold out for at least a 7 year extension on top of the 2 remaining years if the Yankees wanted to re-negotiate his contract? Boras isn’t know for giving away either money or years. I do NOT see the logic in that argument from you.

    I still stand by my original comment. We’ll see though.

    • Ahh, now you are backtracking. First you argued it was a bad deal for the Yanks and now you are saying it’s bad for Cano. But I’ll answer the question.

      It comes down to the question all players have to ask themselves….do I want the security right now of a guaranteed 5 yr $100 Million extension or do I want to take my chances in FA where I’ll probably make more but could make less or nothing if I get hit by a bus tomorrow. Like when someone hits the lottery and chooses the $100M lump sum rather than $150M paid out over 30 yrs. Money in your hand is a powerful thing.

      Many players will take the security of the extension although Boras will ALWAYS advocate going to Free Agency because he knows an open market will pay more. But Can already signed one extension in 2008 buying out 2 yrs of FA.

      Ryan braun, Troy Tulowitzki, Ryan Zimmerman, Matt Kemp, Yadier Molina, etc… all signed extensions giving up Free Agency where they could have made much more. $100M in your bank account is sometimes better than the unknown, even when theunknown can be much more.

      There is a major trend in MLB now where teams are trying to sign their players to extensions because they know they will lose their player to a crazy offer on the open market. The Yanks saved millions by signing Cano to an extension and have lost millions by not signing players before they hit FA. This is a chance for the team to save money and also hopefully not have Cano signed til he’s an old man,

      • I’m not back tracking at all. I was posing a question to you. If you noticed I ended that previous comment by saying: “I still stand by my original comment”.

      • Fishjam, as I mentioned earlier I’m not back tracking at all. My previous post was a question to you not a change of my position.

        Let me ask you but first:
        1) Many of the teams that have signed players long term like Tulowitzki have signed them to save money. But in my opinion and it’s only that it’s because they know they won’t be able to afford them if they hit FA. Now that’s not always the case obviously but it probably is more often than not the case. That is obviously NOT the case with the Yankees. They can afford Cano. So when they sign him should not be an issue. In fact I would venture to say the Yankees would probably prefer to sign him for fewer year but more dollars as a general observation. At least I think that’s the situation in
        his case.

        2) You bring up Cano has already signed one extension. True, he has. Therefore, you are assuming why would he be opposed to signing another now. There is one very simple answer to that comment. SCOTT BORAS. Boras was not his agent when Cano signed his previous extension. And we all know Boras whats his clients to test FA, period.

        3) HERE IS MY QUESTION TO YOU. Are the Yankees really better off because they signed Cano to a 5 yr/$44MM deal plus a team option? After Cano just spent 2 years in the Majors. Under that extension Cano has made or will make with the team option year $59MM. Now let’s assume he did not sign that extension.
        His 3rd year in the league he still was only eligible for pre-arb. He probably would have made about $550K that year.
        His next year he would have been arbitration eligible but still under team control for 3 more years. He probably would have made about $3MM.
        His 2nd year of arbitration eligibility he probably would have made about $7MM.
        His 3rd year of arbitration eligibility 2011 he probably would have made about $12MM.

        Now his total had he not signed an extension for those 4 years he would have made about $22.5MM +/-. But he did sign an extension and for those same 4 years he made $28MM. So already the Yankees are at least $6MM if not more in the whole because he signed that extension.

        Now you ask yourself. But the Yankees got 2 additional years because of that extension for just $29MM. My response to that is. If the Yankees had signed Cano to an extension after the 2011 season and not before as they did. Scott Boras was not his agent. They could have signed a then 28/29 year old Cano to probably a 7 or 8 year deal for $130 to $150MM total depending on the years and maybe even less. And roughly only been paying Cano till he was 35 or 36 anyway. I’m confident in saying that because in 2011 really the only team(s) giving out that many years and dollars to a non pitcher would have been the Yankees.

        I guess in conclusion I don’t see how the Yankees saved any money at all by signing Cano to a extension while he was still under team control at the end of the 2007 for 4 more years. The numbers just don’t add up for you to have drawn the conclusion you did.

        • UYF – Will address your points one by one again:

          1) Whether teams sign extensions to save money or to keep from losing a player, it’s the same thing really. The ultimate goal is to keep that player off the open market where he’ll get more years and more money. That’s th goal with Cano.

          2) I’m not assuming Cano would sign another extension. I don’t know if he will or won’t. I’m saying it’s def in the Yankees interest to negotiate one right now. You said it wasn’t in the yanks interest and now you are saying it’s not in Cano’s interest. Which is it?

          3) Are the yankees really better off from signing Cano to an extension in 2008?

          YES, a Million times better off! Your numbers are totally arbitrary and you missed the fact that Cano was arbitration eligible as a Super 2 player in 2008. That is why Cashman signed the extension.

          In 2008, Cano asked for $4.5M in arbitration and the yanks offered 3.2 so let’s say they met in the middle at $3.9M. That’s already ahead of the salary you said he’d make in 2009 so your numbers are way off. Besides that, he would have been a Free Agent at the end of last yr and looking at one of those Matt Kemp type Free Agent deals so YES, the Yanks saved a boatload of money on that extension. One of Cashman’s finest moves! Why not try it again?

          I can’t post a link because its an ESPN Insider article but they proclaimed Cano’s contract to be the best in baseball. Here’s a snippet:

          The 10 best contracts in baseball
          1. New York Yankees: Robinson Cano, 2B, four years: 2008-11, $30 million, AAV: $7.5 million

          Hands down, Cano is one of the top five players in the American League right now. For all the great work that Yankees general manager Brian Cashman has done for the Yankees — signing free agents CC Sabathia and Mark Teixeira and trading for Curtis Granderson or drafting players like Phil Hughes — he doesn’t get enough credit for his foresight in shrewd multiyear deals like Cano’s.

          FYI, the next 3 best deals were also all extensions signed by Andrew Friedman of Tampa Bay. He’s been signing extensions for yrs to save tens of millions every yr and to keep his players off FA. Look at the team friendly deals of Longoria, Price and now Matt Moore. Extensions almost always save the team money.

      • fishjam, I agree with you the time period seems to be 2014 and the cap. Everything with contracts has to be connected to that time period. With A-Rod, Tex, and CC already locked in with big contracts there appears to be a limit on the Yanks spending that wasn’t the case in the past. Cashman is going to have to pick which direction this team is going to take going forward. The Yanks might be at the point soon where they can’t make the hightest bid on a player like they used to do. That’s why picking up Pineda, and having Nova, Banuleos, and other cheaper pitchers are so important. That being said, I don’t see the Yanks letting Cano walk.

  4. River Ave Blues touched on a Cano extension also in the wake of Zimmerman’s extension….

  5. I looked at the other big contracts and I have Cano signing a 6/140 in 2014. His contract will mirror the contracts of A-Rod and Tex. In 2014 18, 2015-20, 2016- 22, 2017- 23, 2018-24, 2019-20 6/127.

  6. Wow Fishjam…
    The yankees can sign Cano to his 35-36th year with no problem at all. Must remember Granderson, Swisher, Freddy, Soriano, Martin, Kuroda, Jones and maybe Jeter will be gone by the start of the 2014 year. That leaves a lot of money to spend….!

  7. Now that was fun and a lot like the old days!
    Uyf1950, Fishjam and I all giving a little different twist to the subject at hand. Our collective
    prognostications may be right on or way off…only time will tell!
    May the season be another WS season for the Yankees!

  8. I have to agree with Fishjam… I seriously think the opposition to his points in this comment thread is completely underestimating Cano’s ability. Fishjam you said that he is one of the top five players in baseball, but I mean in many ways he is the best.

    He might not literally be the best, but when compared to alternatives at 2nd base, players like Chase Utley and Rickie Weeks come to mind, I am probably missing a couple big names forgive me… These players are not remotely close to Cano in ability. Cano is the best five tool player in baseball, a premium fielder and if he bats 3rd he will easily be top 5 in RBIs next year, especially with Gardner (Second time Through), Jeter and Granderson hitting in front of him. obviously there is the .300 avg and his speed on the base paths is the only somewhat average area of his play; however, he is amazingly quick in the field.

    It is the opinion of many people from what I have read in comments and from analysts that Cano would be the first pick, and my first pick, if one were to fantasy draft a team. He is an anchor in the middle of the lineup and the epitome of consistency and durability. He is in many ways the Mariano Rivera of Position Players at this point in time, in the world of baseball, the definition of confidence and reliability.

    This is in many ways a biased post but unfortunately I consider both oldyankee and UYF to be, and i don’t regret the way in which i am wording this, Idiots for thinking that you can let the man walk. There is no player in baseball that is more highly regarded amongst players. All MLB players consider Cano to be a beast, and that is because he is. There is no player on the yankees roster more valuable, except MAYBE CC Sabathia. I really don’t understand the logic in any of your two opinions that are posted.

    • My friend Aircool, I may very well be an idiot. But it wouldn’t be because I said I think the Yankees should let Cano walk. If you go back to my initial post on this topic at the beginning of this page the one I did on Feb. 29th at 2:37pm I believe the entire post of mine or certainly the vast majority of it revolved around the need or lack of a need to extend Cano before his current contract expires. I may be wrong but I don’t believe anywhere in the post it mentions letting Cano “walk”.

      In fact even if you look at subsequent comments I made here nowhere do I say “let Cano walk”. At least I don’t see any when I quickly re-read them. If you bothered to take the time to look at a lengthy post I did on what the Yankees line up might look like in 2014 based on the stated goal of Hal Steinbrenner to get to the 2014 luxury tax limit you would have noticed I included Cano in that analysis. Now you may want to ask yourself how could I will willing to let Cano “walk” as you said yet still include him in the Yankees future since his current contract expires after the 2013 season. The answer is simple. I COULDN’T and I didn’t

      All this leads me back to what I said when I started to type this comment. I may very well be an idiot. But it wouldn’t be because I said I think the Yankees should let Cano walk. So Aircool, I’ll end this post by merely saying before you call anyone an idiot you may want to look in the mirror. The real idiot may just be staring back at you. Have a good day.

      I want to apologize to Matt and the rest of the Yankees Fans Unite crew for this post. I would not have responded in kind to Aircool if he would have only stated his opinion on Robby Cano without bringing his view of other posters mental state into it.

      • UYF By not extending him you stand a big chance of loosing him ,don’t you?

        • Yes, you do risk losing him when his current contract expires.

          Ballpark, by extending him now 2 full years before his contract expires say for an additional 5 or 6 years as has been suggested and Cano suffers some career ending injury doesn’t the team suffer a real financial loss, even if part of that $100 to $120 or $130MM plus future salary is covered by insurance?

          Ballpark, one other question for you. If extending him now were such a no brainer as I get the impression you think it is. Why haven’t the Yankees done it or at least approached the issue with Cano/Boras?
          In fact you may recall there were reports in the media a few months back that Boras suggested an extension to the Yankees for Cano. In fact I got the impression the Yankees thought so little of Boras offer to talk extension that Boras quickly tried to make a joke of it by in effect saying he was kidding.

      • UYF,You seem like a very smart man and I don’t underestamate you at all,however when you debate or discuss opinions and ideas if someone clearly makes a better point would’nt it be smart to recognize that your opinion may be wrong?
        On I-Yanks we had a guy named t.o. that would never concede when he was clearly wrong ,he instead choose to leave the site.That was a shame because T.O. was a smart guy and added alot to the site.
        When debating we can’t hide behind “it’s my opinion and I’M entitled to it”If so there’s no point in talking to others,one could just keep his thoughts to himself.

        • But when it hasn’t happened yet. It is still in an opinion. When Cano signs or walks then we can look at these statements and say whose opinion was right or not.

        • Ballpark, I’m not sure what I should make of your comment. First you pay me a compliment. Then you are obviously comparing me to a gentlemen form I-Yanks named T.O. who I get the impression from your post here that rather then put up with the bulling tactics (my words) of other posters on that site he chose to “move on”.

          That is a shame that’s the course of action this other gentlemen chose. But sometimes one just has to do what one has to do.

          BTW, Matt said it best just about an hour ago and I quote “When Cano signs or walks then we can look at these statements and say whose opinion was right or not”. Until then you guessed it. That’s just my opinion.

          • uyf1950…
            Fishjam is our pitching grue and Ballpark is our hitting grue.
            Ballpark owns a very reputable hitting school and Fishjam pitched (as a starter) in 4 years of college. Both are much more into hitting, pitching and teaching then I am. Both of them are of the opinion we are wrong, and they may just be right. They are good people who know baseball…almost as well as I do! lol
            Sorry guys, I just couldn’t resist the last part! 🙂

            • oldyankee, Obviously many of you on this board have a history and that’s a good thing. I’m just as sure many posters on this board are “stand up people”.

              As I said in an earlier post. Fishjam and I tend to butt heads more often then not with our differing views. But I have the utmost respect for his opinion, comments and knowledge that he expresses on this board.
              As for ballpark, I think I’ve responded to his comments today in a way that best expresses my feelings. I hope you don’t think any less of me if I leave it at that.

              Have a good day, my friend.

              • uyf1950…
                I am sorry if you misunderstood me, I was not criticizing you in any way at all.
                I only wanted to let you know a bit of their history that is all.
                Heck, you and I are the only ones in our age group that can say, “Yha, I saw him back when ….!”
                As for butting heads with any of these guys, they know that everyone has different ways of looking at things, as long as you understand they also have opinions even if it is not the same as ours.
                Most of the guys on this site are ok, the new ones, we shall see. I have no doubt you will fit in very well with the old timers. 🙂

                • oldyankee, I think I didn’t explain myself clearly, please forgive me. I know you weren’t criticizing me. I didn’t mean to leave that impression in my earlier response.
                  I only meant to say I respect Fishjam’s views and opinion and I’ve said that on this site before.
                  But unlike you and some others on this board I have NOT had enough experience with ballpark to be able to say that. In fact what little interaction I have had with ballpark on this site is him being critical of my opinion, views etc… And I get the impression whether real or perceived that he feels superior to others, including myself. Now in reality that may not be the case but it surely is the impression he has left with me. I hope I’m proven wrong.

                  Please forgive me for not explaining myself clearly enough the first time. I enjoy this site and I enjoy reading your’s and others comments.

            • Kenneth77………
              Guru – Wikipedia…..
              A guru (Sanskrit: गुरु)….. is one who is regarded as having great knowledge, wisdom, and authority in a certain area.
              A grue….is a fictional monster, that dwells in the darkness.

              • Patrick…
                That is me alright but, you forgot the young handsome part…ok, part of it is wrong…the young part! lol
                How you doing young guy? Any action over on the other site? 🙂

    • Aircool…
      I am sorry you think that way of your betters but, on this blog we let everyone have their say.
      Obviously you have no idea what a five tool player is; Speed is one of the tools included in the five tools…Cano is not very fast at all! I have heard so many players called 5 tool guys it is exasperating!
      Five tool players come around every 4 or 5 decades (maybe) but, Cano is not one of them.
      You seem to miss the point, no one is dissing Cano, I am being reasonable. It is easier to bring up a .285+/- 2nd baseman than a guy like Cano! That’s why I would move him to 3rd.
      Giving Cano a contract of 6-7 years after this year, is out of the question. Yankees want to get away from those contracts, they have come back to bite them in the butt!
      Even though Cano is the best young player on the team, he is still not worth having a contract to his 36-37th year. If you or anyone else think he is worth a long contract, that is fine. We all have an opinion, they are not facts…that is why we call them Opinions!
      You have the temerity to come on this site and call people idiots, for having a different opinion than you! Well, all I can say is; welcome to the site but, please drop the name calling, it isn’t welcome here but, you are. 🙂

  9. Good morning Old Ranger.
    You guys are way to sensitve,remember the old site we had many spirited debates.Aircool didn’t call you guys idiots he said your thinking as it pertains to Cano was idiotic,and I have to agree with him and Fish.
    When’s the last time the Yanks let their best homegrown player walk?,answer never

    • Ballpark…
      I don’t think I am wrong in this, he said;

      “This is in many ways a biased post but unfortunately I consider both oldyankee and UYF to be, and i don’t regret the way in which i am wording this, Idiots for thinking that you can let the man walk.”

      Respectfully Ballpark, why am I being to sensitive? He said what he said, I was trying to point out that we don’t call names around here and he didn’t know what a 5 tool player was! After all that, I welcomed him to the site.
      Derogatory remarks of anyone, or by anyone is not welcome but, he is.

  10. Sorry Old buddy,your right the word idiot has no place when talking to the Old Ranger.
    My apology,on to a seperate idea,How are you feelin? and this summer it would be great to take in a Trenton game with Fish and the boys.I hope you can make it.I would like to meet you one day.

    • Group outing to Trenton sounds great!!!

    • Ballpark…
      It sounds great but, I live on the other side of the state. I would like to go, we’ll see how my surgeries go this month. Nothing major, I am going to have them put a zipper in, so they can get in much easier and don’t have as much trouble. My stomach is starting to look like I got in a fight with a big cat …and lost. You know the old saying, “Flip the coin enough, it comes up tails”!
      How is your heart trouble coming along? We were all worried about you. What has it been, 2 years?
      I would be happy to meet up with you guys and ladys, be fun to put a face to the names. So yes, let me know when and where!

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