Morning Bits: Righetti, A-Rod & more…

Good morning everyone.  We now have a world series winner as the Giants swept the Tigers last night.   Soon we will be counting down the days till pitchers and catchers report.

If you are on the east coast please be careful today and tomorrow.

Now for some links…

The Daily News has a nice article about former Yankees player and now Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti.

Chad Jennings of Lohud has a nice week in review of Yankee related news.

Joel Sherman writes that Lincecum’s role reversal should be a lesson for A-Rod.

About Matthew S.

Avid Yankee fan since birth. I have been going to Yankee games with my father since i was young. I have many memories at YSII including many playoffs and world series games. I hope that you enjoy our blog. Comment often.

Posted on October 29, 2012, in Notes & Links. Bookmark the permalink. 12 Comments.

  1. if the yankees have to reduce arods role going out starting this season,.. playing him in 80-100 games total,……… isnt that what ive been saying about the contract, in comparison to willie mays last 5 seasons

    you really, have to assume, without proof,.. that the yankees knew, in their minds and hearts, that arod had used PED’S to bolster his past stats over the 12 seasons, 1996-2007,.. where AROD, as a right handed hitter primarily in the middle of the order batting 4, looked better than willie mays,……. but not by much,… maybe 10% more hits vs mays first 12 seasons, and that the yankees should have taken that into account, ……

    that the numbers in reality were not as good as willie mays, a right hanmded middle of the order hitter,… then looked at willie mays next , final 10 seasons, 1964-1973 ( as mays played 22 seasons total), andf broke it into 5 year parts,…. 64-68, 69-73,…… and given arod a different contract.

    the contract arod should have had going into 2008 should have been around 5 years 100 million.

    and this offseason should be arods free agent year,……. where no one would be giving him 5 years,.. maybe 2 or 3 years, around 10 million a year.

    we can see the truth if we look at all this

  2. 12 seasons 1996-2007 for AROD (1996 was his first real full season)
    2206 hits, 1482 runs, 1482 rbi, 389 doubles, 24 tripples, 513 home runs, 308 avg, 1839 games

    12 seasons 1951- 1963 (mays’ first 12 seasons — did not play 1953 — military service)
    2033 hits, 1258 runs, 1179 rbi, 333 doubles, 106 tripples, 406 home runs, 315 avg, 1691 games

    MLB changed to a 162 game schedule in 1961

    if we prorate each players 12 seasons from above to 162 gamesplayed the results are::

    Mays- -196 hits, 121 runs, 114 rbi, 39 home rruns
    Arod —195 hits , 131 runs, 124 rbi, 46 home runs

    we can see Arod was just slightly more productive than Mays over those years.

    then if we look at the next 5 seasons from both players and prorate it to 162 games we get::

    Mays – 1964-1968 – –168 hits, 109 runs, 103 rbi, 39 home runs
    Arod — 2008-2012—-170 hits, 104 runs, 117 rbi, 34 home runs

    The only problem is over those 5 years, Mays playewd in 755 games, and arod played in only 620 games– a differeence of 135 games — almost a full seaon in games missed vs mays oiver that time.

    So, what does this say for the next 5 seasons for Arod,…. well as so far, Arod and mAys are virtually neck and neck in prorated 162 games for those 17 seasons,… we can assume they will remain neck and neck,, or can we?

    Mays next ,(last) 5 seasons, 1969-1973 we get this::
    1969——114 hits—-64 runs—-58 rbi—-13 homers—–117 games
    1970——139 hits—-94 runs—-83 rbi—-28 homers——139 games
    1971——113 hits—-82 runs—-61 rbi—-18 homers——-136 games
    1972——-61 hits—–35 runs—-22 rbi—–8 homers——–88 games
    1973——-44 hits—–24 runs—-25 rbi—–6 homers——–42 games

  3. Tim Lincecum was absolutely fantastic in the play-offs. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him back in the Giants rotation next year.

    • Bochy deserves all the credit in the world for making the Lincecum to the bullpen move. He didn’t call the PA announcer to ask him not to use the world relief when Lincecum entered the game either.
      I’m in total admiration of the way that Bochy manages and how he can do his job properly yet keep his players loose and having fun.

  4. when the yankees gave arod the 10 year contract entering the 2008 season, they had to have known what they were doing, no? What they did was place a huge BET, that AROD, as a right handed middle of the order hitter, would far out hit willie mays over the final 5 years in comparison to Mays’ last 5 seasons.

    A BET,. a 114 miullion dollar bet.

    was that bet based on mis-representation as Trump says,… was it based on hope,.. was it based on a experts belief that Arod could out hit mays over the last 5 yerars?

    based on what? Pitching is way better now,.. PED testing is high now,….

    only the yankees hirearchy can say what the BET was based on.

    that being said, the yankees have not lost the best yet,.. but they are on the losing side of the bet, based on Arod’s inability to stay on the field over the past 5 seasons – 2008-2012

  5. If Derek Jeter let us say gets 203 hits next season,, he will only need to play 5 more seasons with hits of 190, 170, 150, 130, 110 hits to get 4257, to be the all time hits leader.

    If Jeter does get the 203 hits next season,,, he will probably opt out of the 2014 deal,.. and seek a 5 year contract to go after Rose.

    This is also why I am upset about the AROD contract, combined with the Yankees President calling for a 189 milllion payroll for a 40 man roster,…..( when they cant even get a 25 man roster under 200 million yet)

    These 2 circumstances are converging , like a hurricane,… to deter jeter from getting a decent enough contract to go after Rose,, to go after 4257.

    And this makes me mad

  6. If Jeter does get the 203 hits in 2013 and 190 hits in 2014—– he will be tied with Rose at 3697 hits through their seasons in which they turned 40, through their respective 19th season.

    at that point Jeter would just need 4 more seasons with hits of 170, 150, 130, 110 hits, to reach 4257

    in this day and age of media, internet, businesses in baseball in general,. associated to baseball,… jeter reaching 4257 would mean windfalls of money for both the yankees and jeter,….. that should far surpass anything we have ever seen in sports.

    we still talk about babe ruth and ty cobb, hank arron and pete rose ,….. and they played with no big media or internet.

    jeter getting 4257 will be worth billions, directly and indirectly to the yankees, jeter, and many many other people and companies


    the BET, the yankees made on arod in 2008 was a bad bet,…

    I can only hope and pray that that bad bet does not deter the yankees from making the good BET


  7. IF you take Willie Mays first 17 seasons playing ( did not play 1953- military service)
    and compare it to ARods first 19 seasons ( his first 2 seasons he played in 17 and 48 games, so I include those 2 seasons), this is what they did:::::

    Mays—- 2812 hits, 1763 runs, 1654 rbi, 587 homers, 2446 games, 308 avg
    Arod—– 2901 hits, 1898 runs, 1950 rbi, 647 homers, 2524 games, 300 avg

    Prorating the above to 162 games played we get the following :

    Mays —–, 186 hits,,,, 117 runs,,, 97 rbi, ,,,,39 homers,
    Arod——– 186 hits,,, 112 runs,,,103 rbi,,,,,42 homers

    Those numbers are so close it is insane, considering they are over Mays first 17 seasons and Arods first 19 seasons (first 2 seasons of arod were part time)

    A very very long period of time.

    So we can see now ,,the BET on Arod comes down to the final,next 5 seasons 2013-2017.

    We know Mays’ went down ,, see a post above,…. the bet is that Arod wont go down.

    But going into this final stage of the bet,… we know AROD used PEDs to pump up his numbers during 1994-2012 at times.

    Whoever said it is not fair to compare Arod to Mays, is simply not getting what I am saying.

    You can compare two right handed power hitters, middle of the lineup batters, ,, who are so great, and so close in numbers, over a very long period of time.

    But I am not doing this to compare their careers,.. I am doing this to project what we may see over the next 5 seasons out of Arod.


    • I don’t know about some of the others Jim2244 but, I got it and had it a few comments back! The big thing is, you have gone the way of some other fans; Saying A-Rod used from 1994 to 2012, there is no proof anywhere in the world that he even knew about PEDs before he went to Texas. Unless you know something the rest of the world doesn’t know, I don’t think it is a fair statement.

      As far as comparing Alex and Mays over the years, I have no problem with that at all but, putting a caveat on Alex and his over all playing records is not fair. Back in the day, most players were using Greenes and more of then were on the hard stuff.

      As long as the Yankees will have to pay Alex and his ability to play baseball is still good put him in the line-up and live him at 3er’d.

      I think there is more in the A-Rod tank, Jeter is the question mark! I hope Jeter has some gas left.

      • There is a lot of circumstantial evidence that he used before and after the Yankees…. To think otherwise is naive.

        The liar even said ” I never did PEDS orally “….then later said ” well I knew they weren’t Tic-Tacs”. If he wasn’t doing it orally how could he have thought they were Tic Tacs? He can’t even lie ……. Without making a fool of himself .

  8. We really do not know if it was Cashman that made the bet with full autonomy, which is coming down to 5 years 114 million for 2013-2017, or if it was George Steinbrenner betting his own company’s money.

    I doubt we will ever know, unless Arod one day in retirement 20 years from now, writes a tell-all book about THE BET the yankees made on him.

    but history in comparison to Mays tells us the bet was a longshot.

    In the same light, I have in the past compared Pete Rose to Derek Jeter. Two top of the mine up guys, who get a lot of hits, with some power for doubles,…. Rose more doubles, Jeter more homers,.. but basically equal to extra base hits overall,……..over the first 17 seasons of their respective carrers.

    And what I foiund were numbers as close to each other as you can get,…… even closer than Arod and Mays are in the above analysis today.

    Then, using the same thinking,….. if we look out at what Rose did,…. we can insert comparable numbers for Jeter.

    In this, it would be a way better bet that Jeter will get to 4257 hits, which would bring in way more money over the next several decades, than the AROD bet,….. which when it comes down to reality,… made no sense at all to make.

  9. If we take Jeter’s first 17 seasons ( include the 15 games in 1995) and compare it to Rose’s first 17 seasons, this is what we get :

    Jeter—3304 hits, 1868 runs, 1254 rbi, 313 avg, ,,2585 games
    Rose—3372 hits, 1747 runs, 1013 rbi, 312 avg,.. 2668 games

    if we prorate the above to 162 games we get::

    Jeter —207 hits, 117 runs, 79 rbi
    Rose— 206 hits, 107 runs, 62 rbi

    Jeter can make up games and hits against Rose because in Rose’s 19th season,,, where he turned 40 in April, he only played in 107 games because of the strike season (I believe he played in every game that season), and had 140 hits,leading MLB.

    This comparison is as close to the Mays-Arod comparison as one can get.

    If Jeter keeps pace with Rose, considering the strike season as well, we can see where Jeter can get to 4257 with some effort to push for it

    If Arod can ‘only’ keep pace with Mays over the final 5 seasons,, what we are looking at is AROD to be as embarrassed as Mays was at the end,, playing on the Mets and seeing little time in the 1973 World Series.

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